Interview with Robert Angeloni

Sep 18

Unedited Transcript

Jim Allan: It's not every day I get to sit across from someone who is president of a company that's been around for 50 years. So let's pick his brain. Welcome Rob Angeloni, CVC Communications Agency…. What do you have to say for yourself?

Rob Angeloni: Thank you for having me, Jim.

Jim Allan: So, full transparency. You've been here before I recorded it and I screwed up the audio

Rob Angeloni: But I didn't say that. I didn't want to bring that up…

Jim Allan: you didn't want to bring up making a mistake in broadcasting

Rob Angeloni: No, keep moving.

Rob Angeloni: This is a very honest podcast.

Jim Allan: But I think it says something about you and your generosity of spirit that you would just come back and even though a lot of inconvenience for you

So I do appreciate it and I think that says a lot about you. It's probably why you've been around and successful for so long.

Rob Angeloni: Right. Well, thank you. I'm a production guy. I know things go wrong.

Jim Allan: So I could have asked you the same questions and I still might and but I go you know what. So I went to chat GBT and there's a bunch of AI questions…

Rob Angeloni: Oh…

Jim Allan: so what do you what should you ask someone that's been in business for 50 years and I they spat out a bunch Of questions. So I'm gonna I'll start with these actually though

It's kind of boring because there are a lot of the same questions that you know, okay

But and then when it gives you AI gives you a chance to refine the the prompt they call it a little bit

Rob Angeloni: Absolutely.

Jim Allan: Well, what kind of interview is it? Is it a podcast and it's a podcast

So because it's a podcast they come up with questions like this. So take me back to day one

What did your first office or shop? Look like what did it smell like and their reasoning?

This is smell is great for audio store if it's an audio-only podcast because it forces

forces them To paint a sensory picture.

So what's your first day at CVC? You didn't start CVC.

Rob Angeloni: No, I think I should start with that that I didn't start CVC

I was an assistant photographer for Eaton's photo studio

Which was the old Eaton's catalog and my cousin was a photographer there and I was

part-time Photography assistant I had studied photography and film at Seneca before that. I was during that I was a musician I started as a as a wedding band and you know, we played clubs and everything. I was a drummer since I were 14 years old playing in clubs and weddings and all that

so the creative sense and the production sense was always with me and

At Eaton's photo studio I met a young lady who was a client there and she introduced me to

Murray and Fran.

So Murray Fallon was the founder the original founder of CVC in 1976 and

Fran was his assistant and Admin assistant and it was a two-man operation on Adelaide and Spadina very small. You talked about smell you talked to you taught you you're asking about

Environment. It was a small office. Murray had a you know. A sort of a couch and a desk, you know, that wasn't a that wasn't very small but then there was a a boardroom with which had a production or a sorry a screening room and Back then it was all slides. And so this young lady introduced me to Murray and Fran and They needed a photographer to shoot

training slideshows For clients like Loblaws and Chrysler and and even and even Dominion back then and it was like hey Well, you know click welcome to Loblaws. Here's your benefits package all shot on slides with an audio cassette you know training programs for employees and So the office was just an office a reception Murray's office a bit of a screening room and that was itso it had a backroom storage room and So it was upstairs in an office building I was not used to you know, I'm a kid from the suburbs and you know a musician and a

photographer for junior photographer and now I'm in a business office and

Not familiar territory for me nine to five nine to five driving all the way downtown into traffic and

Parking and then servicing clients going out on shoots

Murray would direct and and I would shoot and Murray would write the scripts and

It was like as I said, this is your benefits package or how does how to stock a dairy counter all those? training programs that were all shot on film and then Fran would process film sometimes in Kodalith film in in the bathroom and put all the phones on hold very small company and so that we just grew from there and I first thing I did was turn the back room into a photo studio and Then we later turned the

Boardroom the screening room into a recording studio and built a little sound booth. So always very technical. I was very production oriented and that that angle

Yeah, so that's where the start was for your AI question somewhere along the line

Jim Allan: I'm always about big decisions here and there's various big decisions to get to work to where you are today. So one decision is like this somehow you transition from being A lowly photographer to to be you must have to be president. You must have got into account management. So you're managing accounts. So how did that happen? How did you suddenly…

Rob Angeloni: Well, We grew a little bit and then the sound studio needed because we would do all of our own narration in English and in French. So we hired an audio person and then we hired and then Fran started shooting Slides and I began directing and then you're always in front of clients and I have a you know a knack for liking people and clients became

Me being able to sell clients was my path and I guess Sears was our my first biggest Sale where we were doing all of the French dubbing and all of the

By then it was it was video and we were doing all the French narrations

For all of their internal training slideshows our training videos

right and so getting to know the client and then I

Just had a knack for people and began connecting with people and Lunches were a big thing for us back then we would invite the client for lunch and then next thing You know, they're they're a client and from being a prospect or a one-time client

They became a 20 year account and that was built on the relationship that we were able to buildwith people and them trusting me and and the the staff and Fran and and then then

Our work, of course.

Jim Allan: Well put it put it this way do you have a secret was there a secret sauce or secret formula? I mean to get clients but to keep them right because that's really a key. It's like

Back then when you're taking them out for lunch or you're taking them out for dinner or or show or how it. But what what did you do to I guess keep clients but get clients and keep them?

Rob Angeloni: Well, I think it starts with you know acquiring them as a client for a job number one and then okay. Well, this worked out. Well, not only did the project work

I mean we knew what we were doing from a creative and a production standpoint. We would do good work and. Not to toot my own horn, but we would always do good work

I had great people surrounding me as we grew

But one project then turns into another project and because of the nature of our business

We're always on location shooting at the clients office at the clients factory

And so you're spending a lot of time with the client and becoming developing a relationship becoming I don't want to say friends but

Jim Allan: Did you take them golfing? old school?

Rob Angeloni: But no.. not a golfer, but because of my music background a lot of my clients were interested in music.

Jim Allan: Oh, so you go to clubs and concerts with them and things like that?

Rob Angeloni: We would go to concerts and we would go to see bands and they would like I had you know Edward who was our Audio-engineer who was also a musician we would do jingles and the clients would be in so my relationship with a lot of them was music based

And then yes, we would go to clients. I have an eye Incommon to talk to them about right? Yeah, you always have commonality and but I like I like people and I like meeting.

You know one day you're working with a you know, American Standard Toilets and the next minute you're working with You know all state insurance and finance or pharmaceuticals

And I always liked the different meeting different people and all of them because I started as the kid with the camera. Okay, I was a kid with a kid with the camera and there's there's the VP of marketing or the director of marketing and he's teaching Me a lot of great stuff.

Jim Allan: I'm the quiet guy behind the camera, right? So you're the chatty guy behind the camera, perhaps.

Rob Angeloni: I wasn't that quiet or if I was directing I wasn't the guy Behind the camera. I was the guy consulting with a client. Okay, is this what you want? Is this the shot?

This is what we're gonna do and you know, the relationship with the client and became

everything and the client people like to do work with who the people do work with whom they like and

Jim Allan: Do you Describe yourself as an extrovert or an introvert or…

Rob Angeloni: I don't think I'm an extrovert. I just I'm just natural. I wasn't you just like going out of my way. I'm not a super sharp sales guy and I always told my sales guys

Don't don't be that way just be about the work satisfied take care of the clients problems

Do the job and don't make it about the money

Jim Allan: So one of my interviews from about three years ago a guy I knew a long time ago, but he's big sales guy I think of him as a salesman like this it could sell. Anything widgets anything and he last last 20 years. He's been teaching sales at a college out in BC

Rob Angeloni: That's not me

Jim Allan: he was here, but it was I thought of him as this, you know, he's just I knew him when he was young I'm wild a little crazy and But he's a big extrovert. So I asked him do you like do you need to be To be good in sales. Do you need to be an extrovert and he said no not no you don't and I found that interesting he he goes introverts can be good too because

You have to listen, right? You have to listen to people. So you don't think you're an extrovert, but where are you on the scale would you say

Rob Angeloni: I'm not an extrovert. I'm not the hard sell sales guy. I'm not the always talking high-pressure guy. I'm just doing my job and building a relationship trying to satisfy the clients and I was fortunate enough that some of my early key clients. Like when I sold Sears

They were Sears had the biggest video studio in in the city, you know in the inverted pyramid building downtown. They had a three camera setup and so we would consult and we would do work for them in and we would do all of their French production.

So the production and the creative and the photography and the video and the music would always be my like my golf And then so when we're at lunch, we're talking about music. We're talking about film. We're talking, you know, that was the connection and you know, there's a great story of I was doing work without mentioning names for a big financial services insurance company actually and We were doing conferences all around the world of you know, incentive conferences and The I wanted to meet the vice president of sales, which I was never allowed to do and I kept saying Okay. Well this this job requires, you know a signature or requires a few let me let me talk to the VP of sales and

And I'll see you know, see how we go and no no, you can't meet him. You can't meet him

I said after a while, I'm still doing a lot of work with them after all I said How come I can't meet this this gentleman? He's very pretty In particular, he's very If you say one wrong word

Rob you're out the door and we don't want that because we have a great relationship and you don't need and so. Eventually the projects got bigger and bigger and I needed to meet the client and I so I go to his. Palatial office upstairs two secretaries out front and I go into his office and you know the big desk and there's a guitar an acoustic guitar sitting by his desk I Said you play guitar?

He goes yes, I'm a songwriter and and I'm you know, I'm I'm passionate about music Bob Dylan and we started talking about music and then so I said, you know, we have a recording studio and you're welcome to come down and and use the studio and you know because it's a passion of ours after hours and From that moment on the tough client became a you know, uh, I'm a great great client

Jim Allan: So yeah, I mean you said something or a couple things you said like it's not always it can't always be about the money…

Rob Angeloni: Right.

Jim Allan: So sometimes I mean I I remember thinking that too

I don't make it about the money at the beginning of a project like you negotiate and I don't want to I don't Want to talk about it anymore. Like just as long as you pay me on time and everything it's Relatively on time and but it does spoil the vibe right and

And the other thing that you mentioned is it's just it's like having something to talk about right?

So you had thisMusic but and I'm I try to tell this to my daughters. It's like it's the fine art of small talk, right? It's like so that there's a you know, I You know, I I

Listen to podcasts about you know pop culture or or politics or sports and music

So again, I've got a few tricks in my bag like you know, oh you're a you're a sports fan, right?

You can talk about something other than what you're doing here and and also we the other thing we were talking about briefly Was COVID screwed up a lot of that and for the a lot of these young younger people They didn't speak to anyone for two or three years, right?

And it is it is something you need to work at I think like it's just like going into a cocktail party

And what do you talk about? Well, let's say you're going to a networking event

Maybe you're prospecting new clients, right? What do you talk about?

Like how how do how do if you were to see someone over there like the president of company X? What do you do when you walk up to them?

Rob Angeloni: No, not everyone can be a salesperson and I I'm not your typical sales person. We all salespeople though, really I got it on but I am but to be a determined aggressive

Salesperson to make cold calls the hardest thing ever.

Jim Allan: Yes

Rob Angeloni: So 90% of our business became referrals one climb was from one one company to another brand and Refers us and it wasn't just me. It was I had two, you know several account people and their Cold call ability was always better than mine

But it was always about the reputation of the company if they say hi, I'm from CVC. Oh, okay

Yeah, well, I know CVC That kind of thing so it wasn't really a deliberate hard sell

approach you just be yourself take care of the client take care of their you solve their problems and Make it about about the client and the money will come and the jobs will come.

Jim Allan: Here's another AI questionI mentioned my daughter and I might mention that a couple times You've hired generations of workers baby boomers Gen X Millennials Gen Z

Is there a secret to managing across 50 years in a shifting workplace culture. Do you have you noticed changes through the years with?

Rob Angeloni: The people that you employ again for fortunate with seasoned

production people camera editors George, you know was was a brilliant director and

Videographer and so always great people and they were senior the younger folks as they came along had a supportive role to my senior guys because I've had employees for for

30 40 years out of those 50 right and You know some of them come and go but a lot of them stay and so dealing with the new newer folks that came In they were you know, perhaps

Better at the technology but still green in terms of making projects work a lot of our

all of our projects have a creative element and so you've got to take technology creativity design and Blend it all together for a communication solution and that solution may not just be a training video or a marketing Video or it could be a combination of a website a new

video elements social media and Graphics, of course animation all of those things working together to solve the clients problems And so the the younger folks just blended in with my senior team

Jim Allan: But have you noticed our people are just people or do you do you notice real changes over the decades in? the young people coming up?

Rob Angeloni: When I visited clients, yes, I noticed a difference in culture

The personal touch and covid probably pushed that the personal touch became

Not as as as important

Jim Allan: Right.

Rob Angeloni: We were always about the personal. I had clients coming down at four o'clock in the afternoon to screen a video and just to hang out and

And to screen a video and to talk about another project and then you know

Five o'clock was a five o'clock beer break at oftentimes and

Because they don't have lunch anymore and and people do and we had great lunches

I used to be able to get we would get clients to To break down the the the corporate

Barrier and just talk as people and some of it was personal you got you know

And I'm into we're interested in in and their their personal lives because it relates to their business lives and so how can I help you and

So it was never it was never that corporate and it was people enjoyed my team me and my team To spend time with us. It's Today it's in as I said covid helped push that it's about the budget. It's about the dollars They're not allowed to have as many lunches as with with their vendors as possible It much more formal. The dollars are more prevalent than ever

and

Covid then pushed everybody working from home

so there weren't you know, even allowed to have lunches or get have personal meetings because I've Covid and natural lunch or a virtual a virtual and that sort of

after covid ended that mentality that culture Remained to a degree. Yes, we started having more in person meetings and things But not to the same same extent and people were clients were working from home My team was working from home and you know the technology became so easy to use and then at first we started as a production house the the the tools are

Were tools, but you had to know how to use them That's not the case now

You know in in internal marketing departments can create a lot of things themselves without needing us You know, it's not as good as what you can do Rob, but it's good enough the home good enough mentality. was prevalent because the tools were there and

On smaller projects they were good enough and I mean covid

Jim Allan: Sounds like it Caused you to downsize a little bit anyway

Rob Angeloni: completely

Jim Allan: but you so you got out of your you don't have the studio anymore

Rob Angeloni: For instance, we don't have a studio any longer and there's a big part of what you did for that. That's how we start for the first 30 years of that 50 maybe you need because not everyone's got a studi. Well, that's what every production company would have that's what that's what also would appeal to the client. Is that we could write the script we could do the strateg. We could you know, do right all that develop all the content and produce the tools and right there in house Which you know a lot of clients a lot of

Vendors couldn't do that ask, you know, we're always technically and you know, I'm creatively involved

Jim Allan: So one more one more question about generational stuff

So I have two daughters and there's and I asked you this last time is starting out in their working lives. And sometimes I hear talk about their bosses and I try to give them advice when I have a can and I Try to look things from the I try to Look at things from the boss's point of view, right? So so here I am talking to an actual boss, right? So when you hire someone right out of school because that's sort of where they are mid mid 20s, right? What are you expecting from people Like right out of right out of school limited experience limited limited to no experience. What are you expecting when you're when you're hiring a 25 year old the 20 year old 25 year old?

Rob Angeloni: We didn't have a lot of younger hires most of our hires were

Because we would we would use freelance camera folks. You were one of them. We would use freelance, you know at times Animators or graphic designers and then eventually just brought them on full-time. So the younger sort of out of college

Employee we yes, we did have them. And they would learn from our from the senior team but because we had a very homey atmosphere at our office studios

You know studios were in the back and we were half the time. We would be jamming at five o'clock. And so it became a very friendly. Environment that the younger folks just melded right in now

Jim Allan: Did you prefer younger people because they weren't so set in their ways maybe no you could train them up.

Rob Angeloni: there was no preferred age. right a demographic if you fit if you were talented and if you fit the Even some of our account people they were seasoned, you know salespeople not everyone can sell

Jim Allan: Right.

Rob Angeloni: so you needed to get salespeople that could handle cold calls and handle customer meetings. And so they weren't a younger a younger demographic and so the younger folks would just learn from my senior team Hopefully and from me as well

Jim Allan: when I was doing my research I came across this and in

2014 Rob was awarded the Governor General of Canada Award for caring Canadians for his ongoing contributions to the famous people players advocating for persons with developmental and physical disabilities, so. You were kind of co-located with them for when I met you years ago There were they were next door, right?

Rob Angeloni: No, they were they were actually in the same building same building

So we were in Liberty Village before it would became Liberty Village

So we were in an old warehouse building on the second floor and the bottom floor was empty

Jim Allan: So why did you get that award though?

Rob Angeloni: Like what did you love because I started be developing a relationship Diane and F famous people players moved into that space below us And explain what they what they do. They're still around what so famous people players is a blacklight theater group

That was started by Diane 52 years ago, and she would blacklight meaning

performers would be dressed and in in in dark and They would perform musical numbers and with the illuminated blacklight And the people that there were people with and the people that were doing it were kids that were challenged mental and some physicalDisabilities and they would perform and then they had a restaurant as well afterwards They had a restaurant as well

And it became dinner theater and those same kids would serve tables and work in the kitchen and perform on stage and work Backstage so Diane had this great ability and this great company where she would take kids and just develop them and make them contributing members to society and And has done that for 52 years they moved in downstairs we became friends I think I told you I met Tom Cruise When they were first moving in Tom Crook there was Diane had set up a cocktails barSponsored by Tom Cruise when he had this cocktails movie was it was out in theaters And of course celebrities would come and visit she started in Vegas with Liberace Opened Liberace show in Las Vegas for years and then you know Paul Newman Newman's own salad dressing sponsored

Interview with Robert Angeloni

Interview with Graham Saywell

Jim Allan